Jivana
Hi everyone. Welcome back. Nice to see you. On our last day of the conference, we have a very exciting, very exciting keynote happening, which I'm looking forward to. Thanks for being here. If you're live, or if you're watching the pre recorded videos, or the recorded video later, I'm excited to welcome Teo Drake actually, probably I should introduce myself, I keep realising, like, introduce myself the first night, but, you know, I'm Jivana Jivana Heyman, my pronouns are he and him. I'm the director of accessible yoga, and I'm joining from Chumash land, which is colonises, Santa Barbara, California. And I'm hosting the conference with the board president, President, Anjali Rao. Anyway, I just want to say how excited I am to introduce Teo, and just so glad that he agreed to be a keynote speaker for this conference. We've been kind of circling around each other for years. So it's just nice to feel like to feel connected and able to learn from you and to be with you in this way. Let's see, I know that, you know, when I What I appreciate most about you is just your openness, sharing your journey and challenges. And I know that you've been just a huge part of this community for such a long time and been working in this world for a long time as an organiser for the Trans and Queer communities, the HIV communities and I think now Woodworking is that right woodworking community as well. I know that you're the I checked out your website, The Tinkering Gnome, which is really exciting, where you have woodworking, which, of course is done in some beautiful way. It's not just a simple workshop, it seems like it's also a collective, of course, yeah. And you're also the co founder of the Transforming Hearts Collective, which is a collective dedicated to spiritual spiritual care, and liberation of Queer and Trans people. So thank you for being here Teo and I'm, maybe you could also say more, I don't know if I touched on all the things, let me know.
Teo Drake
Really, totally. I'm really grateful to be here, and Jivana. Thank you. And again, I agree that it's we've been in each other's orbit. And this has been kind of a way of connecting particularly at a time that I think has been isolating for many of us. So I'm really grateful for this. And I'm also really, thank you for not reading my formal bio, I always want to crawl under the table when that happens. I appreciate the relational sort of introduction. I want to thank all of you for being here, I have been listening to the conference myself, and the conversations have been really a bump for my soul, particularly at a time where I needed a reminder, I think I needed the reminder of, of belonging, I've needed a reminder that that as much of there's so much work to do, there are so many of us doing it and doing it in different ways. And the same ways, and I'm gonna sit with that for a long time, I think but even in the immediate, it has been something I've needed. So. And before I even start, I will certainly talk about who I am and what I do in the world. But I also want to start by saying that I never take these moments for granted that when folks come and, and participate with me when folks practice with me. I'm just deeply honoured. And it's a level of extension of trust that I I never want to take for granted. So I want to honour that. And hopefully that we can, we can talk a little bit, we can practice together a little bit. And, and kind of be together in a way that that I hope touches you in the same ways that I've been touched so far. So as Jivana said, my name is Teo and I am actually calling in from right where Massachusetts Vermont and New Hampshire touch from like literally right there about as far north as Massachusetts as you can get, which is the traditional home of the Nipmuc. And it is fall. It's like a lovely time of year to be here. And I'm hoping that we can start by just sort of grounding a little bit. I miss in person things even as an introvert that's how bad it's gotten as an introvert I actually miss people. And so I'm hoping that we can just take a moment to drop in before we start. So just find whatever way is comfortable for you. You know, however, you want to be in your body, in your breath. Just find that if it's possible and it feels comfortable to find something against your back, just lean into something if it's there for you and just feel it right Find your breath, whether that's a breath of ease, right? Whether it's deep, however that is for you that whatever your breath can touch, sort of you to your back, just find that for a moment
Unknown Speaker
and while you're doing that, tune into your heart space. You know, like, where's what's the, what's the texture of your heart space right now? Open, tight, curious. Longing. What is that for you right now and see if your breath can actually touch that in the warmth of your breath, actually soften a little bit
Unknown Speaker
now, if it's possible to hold the attention, like lean back to whatever's, whatever's holding you upright, right. And feel the strength of that act actually allow your weight to be supported against something. Hold that, at the same time, as you dial into your heart space, hold both of those to be true at the same time, right? That there's something solid at your back. And you can have a soft front, right? And for you, if it's accessible, and if it speaks to you, I, my hands are cold, I'm wearing my hands up and I'm putting them sort of over my heart space. But however, you can call attention to your heart space, it's totally fine.
Unknown Speaker
One of the reasons why I do this work that in community is because I I actually think it's impossible to have an open heart without knowing who has my back. Right? That that to know that that I'm not alone to know that I can lean into something someone, right? A community allows me to actually open that when I'm not in touch with to whom I belong, right? It is much harder for me to unguard my heart space in this world. So as you kind of come back, at any time, in this conversation, anytime, throughout your day, in general, I invite you to do that to check in about about where you can lean into, to find strength at your back. So that you can open your heart. And that's one of the places that I go to throughout my day when I need that reminder. So when I was invited to come do this, I was thinking a lot about it came the invitation and this sort of lead up to this came at a time in my life that as often happens to me that sort of brought me to my knees, you know, and and it was in a in a discernment about sort of how to navigate even my day to day, right? As Jivana said that I've been living with HIV, almost half my lifetime at this point in time in July, it will be exactly half of my lifetime. And I was diagnosed with HIV at a time when, you know, I was watching my friends die. I was 28 years old. I wasn't supposed to make it to 40 like 40 was looking like a stretch at a certain point in my lifetime. Right. And so my entire adulthood has been framed with this, this being unlike the other kids, right like that's that's sort of how I often talk to my partner about my experience in this world because I don't feel like the other kids right like my life has been out of rhythm for a lot of folks my age. And as my friends were you know going to graduate school or starting businesses or starting families buying a house like, right, there's a certain part of the world that I had grown up with that was doing that, right. And another part of my world. You know, my friends were dying, or we were trying to figure out how to care for one another, at a time when even the hospital staff wouldn't touch us. Right. Like, that was the sort of it was a, there was no place that those worlds met. Right. And, but that has been sort of my entire sort of coming of age in coming into sort of, you know, old age, and greying that has been my life experience of that as being a little bit out of sync with the shoulds of the world, I think, was probably how I would talk about it. And, to a certain extent, I've come to some, some peace with that. And at other times, I sort of can hit bumps in the road like everybody else. And this notion of, of, of, like, fixing, and, you know, that sort of industry that we're surrounded by, right? As often really landed for me pretty harshly actually, because there's, you know, I live with HIV, there's, there's nothing that anyone is ever gonna be able to do about that. Right? That is just true. And, and one of my early experiences of living with HIV was often I mean, you know, like, you can imagine, right, I'm carrying this sort of reality, that by the time I got to be 33 years old, I had, I was 30, that's 32 or so, I had 33 T cells, I actually named them because that was all there was right. Like, I had a village that was a very small village. You know, I had a viral load, which is the measure of sort of where the virus is at in my body that was off the charts. Right. And, and I was getting ready to die. Like that was that was, that was sort of true, right? And, you know, I was, you know, I'm 55 years old. So I was raised at a time, when being Queer wasn't something that folks talked about, I didn't even know that was an option. And yet, that was about as Queer as one could be. And I was also growing up at a time where my gender nonconformity was obvious, to me and to anybody else. And still, like, right, the messages about it being so wrong. And
Unknown Speaker
in my early 30s, as I was grappling with, with not being here for much longer, I made a decision, I made the decision that I was not going to die unhappy. I didn't have a lot of choice about the timing of that, necessarily. This was before medications were really a thing. And easy to access. But I wasn't going to die unhappy. I was I was gonna die on my own terms. And so for me, I was I was assigned female at birth, I was raised as a girl. And it wasn't a home address that worked for me. And I didn't want to go out this way. Right. I wanted to know what it felt like to be in my body in a way that felt like home. That's all I wanted, before I left, right. And, and so I made a choice, I made a choice to transition. You know, and I was, you know, I made that choice when I was around 33 years old. And kind of acted on it by the time I was 35. And it was it was the most loving thing I have ever done. For myself. It was the most most courageous thing I certainly have ever done. But it was the most loving thing I had ever done. Because it was the first time in my life I had chosen me over what the world wanted of me what the world said I was supposed to be. And, and I did it like hell be damned because I knew there was going to be consequences, quite honestly, I didn't think I'd be alive to see most of them. But, you know, here we are. But I chose me for the first time, you know, 34, 35 years old. And lo and behold, I actually started to I liked who I was right? The more that I started to. The more that my body changed with testosterone the more that that I was transitioning into a body that I could understand and a way of relating in the world that I could feel at home in. I liked myself and I liked myself in a way that I actually started to. My health started to improve a little bit and I started to collect medication, I started to be able to be in my body in a way that I saw hope in front of me like I did not want to grow up. And I just could not envision myself in the world. As an older woman, like I was, I could not locate myself in the future. And the minute I saw that I could actually grow up and become like a cranky old man that I could live for. Right? Like, that's where I could go. And, and the minute I could locate myself in the future, was when I actually started to show up, like, in a way that was defying possibility, right? It didn't mean that was going to happen, right? Like, there's no guarantees that I would still be here at 55 years old. But because I could locate myself there, right, because I could love who that person was. And could be, I could begin to take steps to do that. Right. And in that, I think has been when I, when I was thinking about coming here to talk to all of you about what was real for me in the moment. That's the thing that that sort of that dichotomy of healing and fixing, right? And what that means, right? And sort of my relationship to, to the yoga world, as well, as largely because I've struggled with that, you know, and fixing is a way that tells us that our bodies, our lives, right, our minds, are a problem to be solved. Right? That that's inherently what fixing tells us right? But that the the effort it takes to fix takes us out of connection out of connection with ourselves out of connection with one another right out of connection with the world around us. Right? It tells us that that that what is here right now is wrong. Right? Is was should never have been. Right. And it carries this notion which and I've been grateful to hear over and over again to this conference, that the ways in which dominant culture lies to us in the West, right, particularly, you know, white supremacy, culture, culture lies about that there's one right way that that, that that's supremacy of any kind is something that we should desire or value, right? That that if we aren't a certain way, that it's a crisis to remedy that, right, like that.
Unknown Speaker
That how things were before or how they should have been, is something that all of our energy should go to. Restoring, right? That that is sort of the messages that that so many of us get about our bodies and our lives, and our minds. And fixing inherently looks backwards, it looks backwards, often to an illusion of something that never ever existed in the first place. Right? That this sort of that we can expend energy to make ourselves into something or to fix something in a way that makes other people comfortable. And I don't think that that is what any of us are here to do. That, you know, the spending that energy to meet this standard of perfection or and sometimes I even lose the words for what other books one of us that's I'm expending the energy to get to that place, right, that get to that place, that body, that mind that that that life, whatever that is that this culture tells us should be to live with that kind of shame, right to live with a shame that that somehow I don't measure up. That was the thing that was killing me, right. There was a virus that certainly was not helping, right. And I don't have a lot of control over that. But what I had control over was was the ways that I came home, the ways that I came home to, to who I am, who I always have been, right and, and who I'm meant to be right. And that, you know, I tell people all the time that transition didn't fix something. Right. It revealed something, it revealed something to me, it revealed something to the world. It it allowed the essence of who I am to come forward. Right. And, and I think people often think about, about transition particularly, you know, for trans folks as somehow fixing, fixing something that was inherently wrong and I felt out of alignment, right. But I didn't feel I still never feel like there was something wrong. Right? That I didn't need to heal. And as a as a trauma survivor, right as a, as someone who the world has, you know, kicked my ass six ways to Sunday, right, as I've had a lot of healing that does need to happen. And the difference, I think between fixing and healing is that healing is is it's, it's rooted in what's already true, right? Like what Nikki said in her keynote, that the essence of who we are is wholeness, right, that healing is actually holds that, that that there isn't a destination or a place or a way of inhabiting our bodies or minds. That is inherently better than anything else. Right. And I think healing is not linear. That's the other thing that for me has been true is that there wasn't sort of like a way of going from point A to point B to point C, right? That healing has been this process of uncovering and discovering and revealing and sort of meeting, there's been parts of me that I had never met before, right, because that I hadn't been shown the way to welcome. And for me that that's, that's what healing actually is, it's rooted in this deep love. deep love for myself. deep love for my community, right? This way of locating myself as inherently belonging. And I feel like that, that that sort of relationship between healing and belonging, right have been integral for me that, so much of my healing has actually been about getting back in touch with the sense of being needed and wanted, and, and to whom I belong.
Unknown Speaker
That, that it didn't need to change anything for that to be true. And, and that is true, I think, for all of us, right, that, that, that fixing this notion of fixing tells us that, that that in order to be welcome, in order to belong, that we need to go off and take care of something right that we need to right some wrongs before we can, can come back, right. And then that is so much about other people's comfort and other people's standards than it is actually about the essence of who we are. And the essence of our belonging about our sort of birthright to belong, I think is often how I think about it. And one of the hardest things about my experience in the sort of yoga of dominant culture, not I think the ways that I understand yoga, the ways that yoga has been talked about here, but the sort of messages that that I've encountered out there has been it's been wrapped around fixing, wrapped around fixing. Like, you know, this notion that, you know, if I could ever touch my toes, which quite frankly, I've just given up on, it's not going to happen. I've never met my toes in that way. But I, you know, I'm incredibly stiff and tight. And there's a lot of reasons why my body is like that. But somehow, if I had if I practice hard enough, like if I did enough Asana, and I could touch my toes, that would mean something, you know, that this notion of striving, striving for a body that can do a thing that can can look away, right, those are the messages that I encountered in mainstream yoga classes. And it didn't resonate for me, it just didn't, I couldn't. It was harmful, truthfully, but, but also I couldn't understand the why. Like, why would I do this to myself, like, what is this and and I came to then I came to experience yoga of devotion, right, this sort of yoga of have an open heart, right, this sort of way of practising that could bring me into my body, right in a way I that was a coming home, that that could bring me back into my heart space in a way of coming home like I was like, that I can do, right that I can show up for. And that I can practice, right. And that was sort of my, the beginning of where a yoga practice and a meditation practice started to make sense for me where I was like, oh, like, I get this, right. And, and that has been sort of what my practice has been. Now has been that. And. And what that looks like is, is the, the best way I can describe it is it's a way of falling in love, again, time and time again, right? That's what my practice is at this point in time. And it shows up in a number of different ways. Like, often on the mat. When I when I when I come to the mat, it's actually an embodied way of remembering, right, what Love feels like, when I met when I meet my own physical self with love, right? That's what often will show up on the mat for me. And so when I come to my mat, that is my hope, right is to is to be to remind myself of that again, right? And it doesn't, you know, it's, there's a sort of way of working through my discomfort working through sort of being here that an asana practice helps me with, right. But ultimately, when I get on my mat, and I bow my head to the floor, like, right, I when I privilege my heart over my head that's when the divine shows up for me also, right? It's that that way of, of being back in touch with the essence of who I am, and I think the essence of sort of who we all are. And in that depth in the practice is only part of it, it's it's this practice of
Unknown Speaker
Tonglen is a very big part of my daily practice, right? It's it's sort of folks aren't familiar. Tonglen is, it's a meditation practice. And it is, in essence, sort of a way of turning towards suffering, and actually inviting suffering in that, that softens us, right, that melts the armour of our heart. And, and it's, it's a paradox, right? It's a paradox of why would I do that? Right? Like, why would I turn towards suffering? Like, why would I invite that in? And again, it was it for me. It's, it's another way, it's another way of, of embracing a loving presence and a loving connection, right? It's a way of softening that, that connects me to other people. And I can make sure that, that there's a Connect, there's a link to a few tonglen practices that that I rely on. So we can send that out. But I'm wondering if, folks, if folks are willing to go on a little bit of a kind of a journey inward with me. Rather than me continuing to talk to you about this, I'd like to sort of walk you through sort of where I go, and how I do this. So again, you can just sort of drop in your bodies into your breaths in a ways that that are comfortable, right? Don't strive, it just sort of what brings you in and if remembering and leaning back, and knowing what has your back can be helpful. That's great. But whatever that is that brings you here. Right? Soft breath
Unknown Speaker
fill your heart space because we're talking about healing, as opposed to fixing when I was thinking about this, what came up is what belief Am I currently holding? Right? That's what what belief don't make clearly holding up that some aspect of myself needs to change. For me to truly belong, what myth am I am I am I hanging on to right and you know, that can be a small thing. You know, it can feel huge and so I think because we're practising in a short time don't go to the deep end of the pool but is there something that comes up for you? That is about I believe that something needs to change like this sort of if only like, if only this was different from me What would change that I could belong breathe into that I think we all have them once you have that, where does that live in you? Like where does that inhabit in your body? Can you feel it? Is there a physical place? Is there something that happens in your body when that comes up? For me off of my shoulders round there's an element of shame to that right I can feel my shoulders round I can feel myself get smaller
Unknown Speaker
just notice it even calling it into awareness what happens for you what happens in your body right what happens in your mind
Unknown Speaker
what comes up now come back to your heart space right see if you can actually drop your breath into your heart space right
Unknown Speaker
what do you really know to be true? What lives there right what is your heart space tell what does your heart say
Unknown Speaker
about that belief? can that softness that that tenderness? Can you feel that for yourself in this moment?
Unknown Speaker
What if this is, you know, that truth that our hearts can have for us? Right? That that that that that loving right that coming back to falling in love that coming back to this inherent sense of belonging, this inherent sort of connectedness that we can have in that in that softness. If we touch into that, if we let our breath touch that, does it change anything in where that belief might live? Or the or the hold that it can have? It might change a little it might not change much at this time. Maybe it changes a lot. Sometimes for me, it depends on the day, right? And what I wouldn't do is I wouldn't enter into a debate with a belief. Right? It's just not worth the argument. Just touch the tender edges that come up around it now the next place that I go in moments like this when I'm wrestling with those beliefs is is Who can I pull in to my heart space with me? To bear witness, is there someone that comes to mind? That person can be present in your life that person can be an ancestor, near or far but is there someone that that your heart space can touch they can be there with you and can that soften that experience that, that tenderness that that connection to another being who's there, right? Who, who already is representing belonging just for a moment hold that just really let that be with you
Unknown Speaker
and then when you're ready, come on back. But don't lose, don't lose that sort of that sort of tether to tenderness and to connection one of the things that that centering a practice or that centering sort of practices, I suppose, that, that, that centre devotion for me, right, this notion of falling in love this notion of sort of reminding myself that, that that I am connected to other people, right that I am connected in that I that I am that I am deeply needed, right. And that I deeply need others, right, that the, my practice reminds me of that all the time. And it doesn't, you know, and I think one of the hardest things about, about doing some of this work in mainstream yoga spaces is often people hear that kind of falling in love is fluff, right? This notion of like, you know, love and light, like, you know, and the ways in which that's, that's sort of portrayed, and it you know, and it's, that's never resonated with me, I think the reason why I have to have a practice that, that calls me back to falling in love is because I actually see the world as it is, right? I actually experienced the world, as it currently is, right? In all of the ways in which you, I hear messages that I shouldn't even exist, right? That I'm, quite frankly, too expensive to keep alive. Like all of those ways in which I experienced the world, and the ways in which I watch those I love. You know, be harmed mentally, right? It's because I see that, that I that I need a practice, right, I need a practice of, of returning to what's true. Right. And returning to a reminder, right, that, that whisper I can hear of, from the Divine from, from my connection with others, right? That, that is bigger than that, right? It's, it's, it's that those things are true, right? Those things are happening the world is it is as it is right now. And, right. And there's more than that, right? That we are all born to be more than that, that we can touch that at any point in time, is a big part of what has allowed me to keep showing up, you know, and it's, my practice at this point in my life is sort of a ritual of returning to devotion, or returning to remembrance of, of to whom I belong. It's at this point in my life, the whole practice. And one of the things that, as I said, as, as I was invited to do this, I was also diagnosed early in the spring with a really rare form of cancer. And it truly came out, it came out of nowhere, you know, and it was caught. As a fluke, it wasn't that I, I didn't feel anything. And it felt like a reckoning again, most of it, actually, I was like, really, really like this too. Like, there was a moment of that. And, but I had to live through all of that, you know, COVID has been hard for I think, particularly in many ways for HIV long term survivors, because there's so many echoes of the early AIDS epidemic. And then there was I had this experience again, and and I had to like, I was a little bit afraid. I was afraid to start talking about what was happening. Because I was afraid that I was going to hear those things that I have heard before, right that the ways in which people I wanted to be able to talk about what was relevant me in ways that I have often wanted to talk about living with a, it's right this, this notion that I that I can be living and dying at the same time, right? That that, that I can I can I can feel immense amount of joy and be suffering at the same time, right that those, none of those things are mutually exclusive. But what I was terrified, I knew I did not have the ability to withstand was people telling me it was going to be okay. Right? Certainly telling me to go do a juice cleanse telling me to do whatever the thing is, I often hear in yoga spaces, right. And what I wanted was, I wanted a way
Unknown Speaker
to feel tender. I wanted a way to sit with. I didn't know if I was going to survive, right? There was no answers. There's no, there's never been answers for me in so many ways. And I wanted a way to be able to still show up. fiercely, right, but fiercely unguarded. Right? And, and I am lucky at this point in time, I have a community of folks who I practice with. And I love who could do that when I asked, I was like, This is what I need of you right now. And they could do that, right? I'm like, I need I need to creep out from my introversion very slowly and tell you how I'm doing on my own time. Right? Almost don't ask because if you ask it, then I feel pulled and I can't like I you know, I will run like a turtle in a shell. But I need to be able to, I need to be able to belong. Like that's the thing I need most of all in this world. And that's the thing I need most of all, is because my legacy is right. I want to leave this world having loved really bigley. Right, I want people to know that they've been loved by me. And that's it. Right? Like, that's it. The rest of it, you know, is cause and effect. But this is a thing I wanted. And this is a thing, as I've been struggling, you know, and I, I had surgery and over the summer and things seem okay. They might not be but they seem okay. But my practice, right, my practice and the community that I live in, allowed me to kind of be fully transparent, and, and still open. And I think there's nothing else I can ask of sort of the difference between fix, right? I had cancer, there was like sweet luck, all I was gonna be able to do about that, like somebody else was gonna have to like maybe deal with medical stuff, but it was what it is, right. But no matter what the outcome that was that was going to be it was I could heal, right? I could I could, I could heal. imperfectly, I could heal in the moment, but I could heal. Right. No matter whether or not there was an outcome that I was going to be thrilled about, I could still heal. And that's sort of the been the big reminder, as I was kind of leading up to coming here is that I think we're all as we are meant to be. And I think that we can serve as a reminder to one another that that's true. And I'm grateful to be here and I think I would love to rather than continued to talk at you, I would love to talk with you. And if there's any, like, questions, comments, what do you you know, what do you do? As a practice for love and devotion? And, and particularly, how do you remind yourselves in one another, that you belong? And that you're loved. And that we need you to survive as much as you need to to survive. So I'm really grateful. And I think I have trouble reading. So someone else is going to read the chat for me. But also there's a way to actually for us to interact directly. So either whatever speaks to you would be great. But I'm grateful. I'm grateful that you're all here. And for the chance for me to remember this as well.
Jivana
Carrie, let's see Carrie.
Unknown Speaker
i Yeah, I'm Carrie here. I'm in St. Louis. I don't think I have like a question. But I think the thing that resonated with me is when you talked about fixing like back to something that never existed in the first place. And as a person who is trying to be a recovering fixer, like that really spoke to me, because it seems like it seems like that was the block and trying to figure out for me what it means to heal from my trauma of being in spaces where I didn't feel like I belonged. So I am. Yeah, I'm absolutely here for that. And I'm here for when you talked about how healing is rooted in what's already true. And I think that was mind blowing for me because like I am, you know, and that's like, that's the fact I am. And trying to fix feels like I'm disregarding what I already am. So I'm excited to add those thoughts and ideas to my practice. So thank you. Thank you so much.
Jivana
And Patti has her hand up. Hey, Patti.
Caller
Hi, how is everybody today? I went out dancing last night. So I came in a little late.
But it's been a great weekend. And thank you for from one long term survivor to another thank you for for speaking on HIV and AIDS. And you know, and I loved, what I was hearing in the healing rather than fixing is fixing the use of it's usually something you hate about yourself. And healing is something that I love about myself that I need to get back to. And you know, I've been 30 years positive. So there's been a lot of crap that's gone on in my life. And I love when you said bring something and I had a daughter when I was positive, I had a son who I gave up for adoption, right before I became positive, just became a grandmother with him. So that's kind of cool. But my daughter was born when I was positive back in 95, and no wait, 96. Really, nobody thought that, you know, it was crazy. Having a baby, you know, oh, my God, you're gonna and I had so many people telling me I was a bad mother for bringing a life into the world at this time, you're gonna die, she's gonna die. You know, all this. So that was like, and so when you say bring something into heart that you hold on to that girl, my little girl, I named her Angelica, she's 26. Now not positive, engaged. And she's the one who is always saying to me, whenever I'd say, Oh, I'm so stupid. Oh, why did I you know, all those negative voices in my head, or people said something to me, and I get upset about it. Because of my you know, you AIDS bitch, and you know, stuff like that, that that child is the one who kept saying, Mommy, no, you are amazing, you know, and I have to keep keep her voice in my head. I had another person and my yoga, teacher training, which I just did, over pandemic, which kept me sane. I mean, if it wasn't for the spiritual programme, of my yoga, teacher training, I think I would have gone and say, I suffer from, you know, depression and trauma, I was a sex worker. So there's all that stuff that comes in, but one guy in my class kept saying, telling me how amazing I was. And I kept going, I gotta replace those negative voices in my head with your voice, Can I record it and just put it in my room? And, you know, listen to you, cause, a lot of times we don't, like I don't I, you know, the imposter syndrome? The, you know, I'm not good enough. I'm not, you know, why am I here? What am I? What am I doing, you know, and just to have you say, you know, bring in that suffering. And then find something that you love, and instead of fixing, just start healing. And I think I've been doing that most of my life lately. And I just love thank you for for sharing. And thank you for bringing this to the conference.
Unknown Speaker
I loved it.
Caller
I don't know what else to say. That's it. Thanks.
Jivana
I wanted to read you some message. So Karen here tried to come on the line before wrote in that chat instead. And she said, Thank you so much for opening your heart to share with us here today Teo as a Black woman in a large body and felt the societal pressure to fix who I am and how I show up for most of my life. Thank you for echoing the sentiments of my heart. Jane said you're a magnificent human, the practice of bringing somebody beloved, a loving kindness human who loves you, just as you are was profound. Thank you so much. And then also, there was a another question someone was asking for a reference for tonglen practice, like maybe a recommendation.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I can actually, I can actually have the ability to send things out I can actually linked to that, but Joan Halifax has has a beautiful script that I think relatively easily accessible. And there are recordings of her actually leading it. But there's also a script I have, I actually have a tonglen practice that I have recorded for another training that that I have access to that I can also send along and I can send along the, the PDF of my own cues. And you can read, record your own voice off of those cues, right. Like, it's an easy thing to do. So I'm happy to send those along.
Jivana
We could add that to the archived recording. Okay. But I love what you just said about reading it in your own voice. Because I think that's a beautiful, beautiful, powerful practice to hear your own voice when you're practising. I love that. Carol said, Thank you so much. Thank you for sharing in such a heartfelt way. I love the idea of showing up fiercely unguarded. I appreciate your authenticity. And if anyone else has comments, or wants to come on, I want to thank you. I mean, that was powerful. I love you. Like I said, you share so much about your journey. And I think it's it can feel so vulnerable. But that's what, it's such a gift to us. So I really appreciate that. Thank you.
See, anything else you want to share with us? Or
Unknown Speaker
well I'm so grateful I think that I appreciate hearing other folks in the ways that this sort of resonates because it's definitely you're right. It is. It's, it's it's tender, and vulnerable. But it's vulnerable in a way that I, for me, it's vulnerable in from a place of service, but it's also vulnerable from a place of groundedness. Right? It's because of my practice, because of being in community. It isn't a fragile vulnerability, right. It's, it's something that I feel like my heart can handle. You know, I think there's a big difference between heartbreak which I think this this being alive requires of us right healing requires of us doing any of this work in the world requires us to have our hearts broken over and over again. But practice is what makes the difference between heartbreak and my heart shattering, right? Like heartbreak is actually sustainable. From a place of love and devotion and care, particularly communal care, right? But it becomes very fragile when it's willful, isolated, and an ungrounded. Right. And when there's no one surrounding us, or we feel that there's no one surrounding us, or we have to go it alone, that's when I know my heart was sadder. Right. And that's a big difference. And so doing this work in this way with all of you is, is sort of how heartbreak is sustainable?
Jivana
Okay, and I see Audrey has her hand up. Let's see.
Unknown Speaker
Hi, I'm Audrey, and I have quite a lot to say, but I'll be short. Otherwise, we'll be here for hours. Thank you so much. Because that was really, really, really powerful and wonderful. And I think it's a message that needs to be spread wider about the fixing, not fixing, but healing. I live with a serious chronic illness and so does my head in all the stuff about yoga will fix you if it wants, it will heal, it will help but it won't cure me. So yeah, thank you so much for that. And I wanted to share as well. I had some kind of vision as you did as well of me as an old woman when I was diagnosed like maybe two or three years after my diagnosis, and I really didn't think I would live to an old age. And that just reminded me of that. So yeah, I think I that's something that I could work with, as you said, like in terms of devotion and love and things like that. And I would have a question for you, which is quite vague sorry. But how did you build your own community, your own support system when, whether that was when you first got your diagnosis of HIV or when you decided to transition? What all you know, earlier in the year, or maybe when COVID hit whether like how did you build your community and your support system? Thank you so much.
Unknown Speaker
Thanks You? Yeah. I think that I've I think I've been persistent in showing up and continuing to show up in places time is how I build community. And I think it's communities actually more than probably one. And, and I think, allowing myself to be seen, right, allowing myself to be as I actually am, as opposed to, you know, some poster child or some, like, you know, marketing ad or whatever that, like, yeah, that actually allowing myself to be fully seen, has been a big part of that. But also, you know, like, I think my practice has reminded me of what my own worth is. And so it has also helped me leave places that have not, been places that I think that would, I would want to call home. Right. And, and so it's been about that, but it's also just finding, I think, folks that that, that when I'm in their presence, I feel more myself than not. And those are the folks that I tend to be drawn to, more than anything else in this world. Right. And, and that's a big part of it. And, you know, I don't belong anywhere, that's perfect. But I belong a lot with a lot of people that I love dearly. And I would go down in flames with them, you know, like, I love them enough to do this work in a way that I will stay on with them, right, like, those are the things I pay attention to. And I don't know if that makes sense. But that's sort of the things that that I look inward for to know if I'm actually in a place where I want to build belonging or not.
Jivana
There's a comment from Jamie, thank you so much for trusting us with your truth. And seriously, what you just said about heartbreak and shatter really resonates. That was what you talked about previously. I just want to make sure you here this I appreciate that. And I love that conversation about healing versus fixing. It's such an issue with the world of accessible yoga, and I feel like, you know, our work has been misconstrued in that way, for years. And I tried to bring it up also with the yoga therapy community, because I think they're really stuck in that. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker
Do we have time for One more question. Sure. I didn't realise I had the question until just now. So as you were talking about community and knowing when you should leave and when you should stay. That totally resonated with me. However, what I'm currently facing, and I'm wondering if you've had an experience with it is when you know, it's time to leave a place that you don't want to let go of. Right? Yeah, so much you love about it, but it's not, you know, I feel torn.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah. Not to dive deeply. But you know, my family of origin is exactly that place that I've had to, to let go of. And there's a paradox, right. I think sometimes we have to let go of things. Long before we want to right for healing to happen. And again, it doesn't mean I can't pick something back up, but But letting go is letting go and then paying attention to what happens in my body in my heart when I do over time. That's been helpful. But yeah, you know, and again, it's practice, right? Sometimes we pick things up, put them down, pick them things up, put them down, but, but but there's wisdom, we know, like, we know when we need to at least take a break if not walk away. And you know, I don't think it's easy. But rather than fight with that, I think turning towards what we do love and who loves us is to do that. Right? It's I just don't
Unknown Speaker
is right.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, like right neural pathways. I don't I don't stay in I don't stay in conflict with that stuff. They are who they are they it is what it is and right. And what paths do I want to cut? Right? Who do I want to turn towards? is the only way that I think I've found that to work.
Unknown Speaker
Thank you so much.
Jivana
Thank you Teo I think we're out of time.
Unknown Speaker
Awesome. Thank you so much for all all being here and witnessing
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
